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	<title>Comments on: Logistics of moving the Coyotes to Hamilton</title>
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	<link>http://www.modsuperstar.ca/archive/2009/05/22/logistics_of_moving_the_coyotes_to_hamilton/</link>
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		<title>By: jamEs harris</title>
		<link>http://www.modsuperstar.ca/archive/2009/05/22/logistics_of_moving_the_coyotes_to_hamilton/comment-page-1/#comment-3089</link>
		<dc:creator>jamEs harris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Apr 2011 07:27:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.modsuperstar.ca/?p=1349#comment-3089</guid>
		<description>This was written a few years ago when Quebec was barely in the conversation.  Really my map lays out the most ideal situation geographically for the NHL, though maybe not realistically.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This was written a few years ago when Quebec was barely in the conversation.  Really my map lays out the most ideal situation geographically for the NHL, though maybe not realistically.</p>
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		<title>By: jacksss</title>
		<link>http://www.modsuperstar.ca/archive/2009/05/22/logistics_of_moving_the_coyotes_to_hamilton/comment-page-1/#comment-3088</link>
		<dc:creator>jacksss</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Apr 2011 06:17:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.modsuperstar.ca/?p=1349#comment-3088</guid>
		<description>What about Quebec City? Fan base there is just as legitimate as Winnipeg and Hamilton and above that of Kansas and Vegas</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What about Quebec City? Fan base there is just as legitimate as Winnipeg and Hamilton and above that of Kansas and Vegas</p>
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		<title>By: St4rr</title>
		<link>http://www.modsuperstar.ca/archive/2009/05/22/logistics_of_moving_the_coyotes_to_hamilton/comment-page-1/#comment-2956</link>
		<dc:creator>St4rr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Sep 2010 03:42:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.modsuperstar.ca/?p=1349#comment-2956</guid>
		<description>i think its a great idea to have 32 teams but u shouldn&#039;t move the panthers to KC (they have an ok fanbase) and move Las Vegas 2 seattle. and maybe move the coyotes 2 hartford or something</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i think its a great idea to have 32 teams but u shouldn&#39;t move the panthers to KC (they have an ok fanbase) and move Las Vegas 2 seattle. and maybe move the coyotes 2 hartford or something</p>
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		<title>By: Eric</title>
		<link>http://www.modsuperstar.ca/archive/2009/05/22/logistics_of_moving_the_coyotes_to_hamilton/comment-page-1/#comment-2646</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Sep 2009 23:38:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.modsuperstar.ca/?p=1349#comment-2646</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s what I think the Conferences setup should be if Phoenix moved to Hamilton.

Northeast
Montreal Canadiens, Ottawa Senators, Toronto Msple Leafs, Boston Bruins and Hamilton.

(Here there&#039;s potential for new rivalries while maintaining the Montreal-Boston Rivalry.)

Atlantic
New York Islanders, New York Rangers, Buffalo Sabres New Jersey Devils, Philadelphia Flyers.

(Here we can have the battle of New York State along with Philly.) 

Southeast
Washington Capitals, Atlanta Thrashers, Florida Panthers, Carolina Hurricanes and Tampa Bay Lightning.

Central
Detroit Red Wings, Pittsburgh Penguins, Columbus Blue Jackets, Chicago Blackhawks and Nashville Predators.

(Here we can enhance the Pittsburgh and Detroit rivalry.)

Northwest
Edmonton Oilers, Calgary Flames, Minnesota Wild, Colorado Avalanche and Vancouver Canucks.

Southwest
Anaheim Ducks, Dallas Stars, St.Louis Blues, Los Angeles Kings and San Jose Sharks.

(Dallas and St.Louis are about the travel distance when heading to California.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s what I think the Conferences setup should be if Phoenix moved to Hamilton.</p>
<p>Northeast<br />
Montreal Canadiens, Ottawa Senators, Toronto Msple Leafs, Boston Bruins and Hamilton.</p>
<p>(Here there&#8217;s potential for new rivalries while maintaining the Montreal-Boston Rivalry.)</p>
<p>Atlantic<br />
New York Islanders, New York Rangers, Buffalo Sabres New Jersey Devils, Philadelphia Flyers.</p>
<p>(Here we can have the battle of New York State along with Philly.) </p>
<p>Southeast<br />
Washington Capitals, Atlanta Thrashers, Florida Panthers, Carolina Hurricanes and Tampa Bay Lightning.</p>
<p>Central<br />
Detroit Red Wings, Pittsburgh Penguins, Columbus Blue Jackets, Chicago Blackhawks and Nashville Predators.</p>
<p>(Here we can enhance the Pittsburgh and Detroit rivalry.)</p>
<p>Northwest<br />
Edmonton Oilers, Calgary Flames, Minnesota Wild, Colorado Avalanche and Vancouver Canucks.</p>
<p>Southwest<br />
Anaheim Ducks, Dallas Stars, St.Louis Blues, Los Angeles Kings and San Jose Sharks.</p>
<p>(Dallas and St.Louis are about the travel distance when heading to California.)</p>
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		<title>By: modsuperstar</title>
		<link>http://www.modsuperstar.ca/archive/2009/05/22/logistics_of_moving_the_coyotes_to_hamilton/comment-page-1/#comment-2575</link>
		<dc:creator>modsuperstar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jun 2009 13:34:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.modsuperstar.ca/?p=1349#comment-2575</guid>
		<description>@greg You definitely raise an interesting point.  I think the scheduling will definitely be a challenge in a 32 team league given the current structure of 6 games against divisional rivals, 4 against conference rivals and 2 against opposite conference rivals.  They would be hard pressed to come out with a balanced schedule using the current 82 game slate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@greg You definitely raise an interesting point.  I think the scheduling will definitely be a challenge in a 32 team league given the current structure of 6 games against divisional rivals, 4 against conference rivals and 2 against opposite conference rivals.  They would be hard pressed to come out with a balanced schedule using the current 82 game slate.</p>
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		<title>By: Greg</title>
		<link>http://www.modsuperstar.ca/archive/2009/05/22/logistics_of_moving_the_coyotes_to_hamilton/comment-page-1/#comment-2574</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jun 2009 00:55:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.modsuperstar.ca/?p=1349#comment-2574</guid>
		<description>Interesting ideas, my only comment is that... with the divisions set up as you&#039;ve suggested they might be, the Canadian teams are in their own separate divisions!  I guess it wouldn&#039;t matter too much, but with the majority of games during the season being intra-divisional, it might strain the relationship between the American fan base and the Canadian fan base, never seeing each other really.

Definitely an interesting problem.  I guess we&#039;ll have to wait and see.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting ideas, my only comment is that&#8230; with the divisions set up as you&#8217;ve suggested they might be, the Canadian teams are in their own separate divisions!  I guess it wouldn&#8217;t matter too much, but with the majority of games during the season being intra-divisional, it might strain the relationship between the American fan base and the Canadian fan base, never seeing each other really.</p>
<p>Definitely an interesting problem.  I guess we&#8217;ll have to wait and see.</p>
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		<title>By: monkeyboy</title>
		<link>http://www.modsuperstar.ca/archive/2009/05/22/logistics_of_moving_the_coyotes_to_hamilton/comment-page-1/#comment-2554</link>
		<dc:creator>monkeyboy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Jun 2009 20:15:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.modsuperstar.ca/?p=1349#comment-2554</guid>
		<description>Yes, the Panthers ownership group is terrible (however happily, they are on their way out ) but financially the team isn&#039;t and has never really been on shaky ground and that&#039;s the main determining factor or whether a team is going to get moved or not. I  know there are a  few truly troubled teams in the South but who&#039;s going to buy them in this economic climate if Balsillie succeeds in getting the Coyotes? The only city that has any kind of real chance of landing a team in the US is Kansas City due to AEG&#039;s ties to the new arena there. I see a lot writers and fans online talking about a team moving to Las Vegas. Where are they going to play? No NHL ready rink there and who&#039;s going to pay to build one? Everyone is broke right now so taxpayer money for a rink in a small-market city not even remotely clamoring for hockey seems highly unlikely. Like Winnipeg or QC, Seattle and Portland also get mentioned a lot as destinations but those cities seem unable or unwilling to support NHL teams. After this Coyote mess is sorted out I don&#039;t really expect much more change to come to the NHL map anytime soon.

I think the best thing for the NHL to do would be to let Balsillie have the Coyotes leaving KC as a fallback destination for any other team that needs to move thus keeping the league at 30 teams which to me is better than bumping up to 32 due to the dilution factor. However I don&#039;t think that&#039;s what&#039;s going to happen because if the Coyotes do come to Hamilton only Toronto and Buffalo would get paid off. Instead if the Coyotes stay in PHX or move to say KC instead the league could later grant Hamilton a very expensive expansion team where all franchises could pocket millions of dollars. That&#039;s what I think will happen with a 32nd team to come a few years later when the recession is over and hopefully with all the troubled teams sorted out.

As for your original point of how the league would look if the Coyotes do move to Hamilton. It seems according to Balsillie&#039;s application as if they will play in the Northwest Division with Colorado sliding over to the empty spot in the Pacific. While that means a lot of travel, this would be great in a way for Hamilton because at least they would have 3 other Canadian teams in their division to play against. This would probably be a good thing for Canadian TV double headers because you would have a team based in the East playing a lot of late road games in the West. Imagine a Toronto-Montreal game early and then a Hamilton-Edmonton game late with a heavier built in eastern audience staying up late to watch their hometown Tigers or whatever they will be called. I also think this might be the best way to go because the only way to get Hamilton into the Eastern Conference (without realigning everything) would result in at least 3 other teams having to move divisions in addition to Colorado already going to the Pacific. An example of this would be: Hamilton would move to the NE Division, Boston would slide over to the Atlantic Division, New Jersey would move to the the SE Division with Atlanta being bumped to the Western Conference. You now have the usual three 5 team division format in the EC. Atlanta is now in the Central Division with say Columbus or Chicago forced to move to the Northwest to fill the spot vacated by Hamilton . In that example you could bring Colorado back to the NW as well and move Vancouver into the Pacific to make a closer geographical division to help address Columbus or Chicago&#039;s travel situation. That&#039;s a lot of teams moving and losing rivals so that won&#039;t go over too well. Probably easier to just make Hamilton have a heavy travel load since Colorado should be happy with the change by making out pretty good in the Pacific playing more against the California based teams and an old playoff nemesis in Dallas instead of playing Edmonton, Vancouver &amp; Calgary all the time.

Good luck getting a another team up there, you guys deserve it and I think the league as a whole will be better off with a 7th team in Canada. I don&#039;t know whether Balsillie is going to pull off getting the Coyotes but this should open the NHL&#039;s eyes to the viability of Hamilton as an NHL market. The NHL needs another owner like Balsillie so they should just give a team one way or another and get it over with already.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, the Panthers ownership group is terrible (however happily, they are on their way out ) but financially the team isn&#8217;t and has never really been on shaky ground and that&#8217;s the main determining factor or whether a team is going to get moved or not. I  know there are a  few truly troubled teams in the South but who&#8217;s going to buy them in this economic climate if Balsillie succeeds in getting the Coyotes? The only city that has any kind of real chance of landing a team in the US is Kansas City due to AEG&#8217;s ties to the new arena there. I see a lot writers and fans online talking about a team moving to Las Vegas. Where are they going to play? No NHL ready rink there and who&#8217;s going to pay to build one? Everyone is broke right now so taxpayer money for a rink in a small-market city not even remotely clamoring for hockey seems highly unlikely. Like Winnipeg or QC, Seattle and Portland also get mentioned a lot as destinations but those cities seem unable or unwilling to support NHL teams. After this Coyote mess is sorted out I don&#8217;t really expect much more change to come to the NHL map anytime soon.</p>
<p>I think the best thing for the NHL to do would be to let Balsillie have the Coyotes leaving KC as a fallback destination for any other team that needs to move thus keeping the league at 30 teams which to me is better than bumping up to 32 due to the dilution factor. However I don&#8217;t think that&#8217;s what&#8217;s going to happen because if the Coyotes do come to Hamilton only Toronto and Buffalo would get paid off. Instead if the Coyotes stay in PHX or move to say KC instead the league could later grant Hamilton a very expensive expansion team where all franchises could pocket millions of dollars. That&#8217;s what I think will happen with a 32nd team to come a few years later when the recession is over and hopefully with all the troubled teams sorted out.</p>
<p>As for your original point of how the league would look if the Coyotes do move to Hamilton. It seems according to Balsillie&#8217;s application as if they will play in the Northwest Division with Colorado sliding over to the empty spot in the Pacific. While that means a lot of travel, this would be great in a way for Hamilton because at least they would have 3 other Canadian teams in their division to play against. This would probably be a good thing for Canadian TV double headers because you would have a team based in the East playing a lot of late road games in the West. Imagine a Toronto-Montreal game early and then a Hamilton-Edmonton game late with a heavier built in eastern audience staying up late to watch their hometown Tigers or whatever they will be called. I also think this might be the best way to go because the only way to get Hamilton into the Eastern Conference (without realigning everything) would result in at least 3 other teams having to move divisions in addition to Colorado already going to the Pacific. An example of this would be: Hamilton would move to the NE Division, Boston would slide over to the Atlantic Division, New Jersey would move to the the SE Division with Atlanta being bumped to the Western Conference. You now have the usual three 5 team division format in the EC. Atlanta is now in the Central Division with say Columbus or Chicago forced to move to the Northwest to fill the spot vacated by Hamilton . In that example you could bring Colorado back to the NW as well and move Vancouver into the Pacific to make a closer geographical division to help address Columbus or Chicago&#8217;s travel situation. That&#8217;s a lot of teams moving and losing rivals so that won&#8217;t go over too well. Probably easier to just make Hamilton have a heavy travel load since Colorado should be happy with the change by making out pretty good in the Pacific playing more against the California based teams and an old playoff nemesis in Dallas instead of playing Edmonton, Vancouver &amp; Calgary all the time.</p>
<p>Good luck getting a another team up there, you guys deserve it and I think the league as a whole will be better off with a 7th team in Canada. I don&#8217;t know whether Balsillie is going to pull off getting the Coyotes but this should open the NHL&#8217;s eyes to the viability of Hamilton as an NHL market. The NHL needs another owner like Balsillie so they should just give a team one way or another and get it over with already.</p>
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		<title>By: modsuperstar</title>
		<link>http://www.modsuperstar.ca/archive/2009/05/22/logistics_of_moving_the_coyotes_to_hamilton/comment-page-1/#comment-2553</link>
		<dc:creator>modsuperstar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Jun 2009 18:00:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.modsuperstar.ca/?p=1349#comment-2553</guid>
		<description>I agree with you about the Panthers.  My scenario is an ideal situation, but would require so many things to happen it&#039;s really unfeasible.  The issue with the Panthers is that they are one of those teams that always in the mix of troubled franchises.  In 2008 Sports Illustrated listed theirs as the 2nd worst ownership group, next to the Toronto Maple Leafs.  I think for southern teams to thrive they do need to be competitive and it&#039;s been a very long time since the Panthers have had a sniff at the playoffs.  This would be the main reason I would lump them in with teams on shaky ground.  

Winnipeg and Quebec are nostalgic choices, but in the end unfeasible.  There just isn&#039;t any major corporate money in Manitoba.  The only viable place to put a team is in southwestern Ontario since there is loads of people, corporate money and apathy towards Toronto.  The existing football rivalry between the Toronto Argonauts and Hamilton Tiger Cats shows there is definitely some fertile ground to establish rivalries.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with you about the Panthers.  My scenario is an ideal situation, but would require so many things to happen it&#8217;s really unfeasible.  The issue with the Panthers is that they are one of those teams that always in the mix of troubled franchises.  In 2008 Sports Illustrated listed theirs as the 2nd worst ownership group, next to the Toronto Maple Leafs.  I think for southern teams to thrive they do need to be competitive and it&#8217;s been a very long time since the Panthers have had a sniff at the playoffs.  This would be the main reason I would lump them in with teams on shaky ground.  </p>
<p>Winnipeg and Quebec are nostalgic choices, but in the end unfeasible.  There just isn&#8217;t any major corporate money in Manitoba.  The only viable place to put a team is in southwestern Ontario since there is loads of people, corporate money and apathy towards Toronto.  The existing football rivalry between the Toronto Argonauts and Hamilton Tiger Cats shows there is definitely some fertile ground to establish rivalries.</p>
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		<title>By: monkeyboy</title>
		<link>http://www.modsuperstar.ca/archive/2009/05/22/logistics_of_moving_the_coyotes_to_hamilton/comment-page-1/#comment-2552</link>
		<dc:creator>monkeyboy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Jun 2009 03:27:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.modsuperstar.ca/?p=1349#comment-2552</guid>
		<description>Sorry buddy but the Panthers aren&#039;t going anywhere so you might want to redraw your map. They are getting sold for a profit and have a pretty unbreakable lease anyways. It would a take situation like the Coyotes are in now to even make it remotely possible and that&#039;s just not going to happen. You guys up north always like to lump the Panthers in as a team ready to move but unfairly so. Yes, the Panthers struggle on the ice and in attendance but control of the Panthers means control of the other events and advertising revenue in the Panthers rink the bank Atlantic Center. Know what that means? A lot of money. The Panthers are only one piece in a larger puzzle that is ultimately a money maker.

I really do hope you guys get another team up there (Canada deserves at least one more) but it&#039;s hard for me to see it happening anywhere other than Hamilton (that mainly due to Balsillie&#039;s $$$). Winnipeg has no one with the bucks to own a team that I know of and a rink built for a minor league team. Quebec City has an old rink and would have that same old problem of attracting free agents with the heavy French environment there. Despite living in Miami I started off as a WHA fan (B&#039;ham Bulls adopted the Oilers after the Bulls folded) and miss the Jets and Nordiques but I just don&#039;t see the NHL returning to those cities anytime soon if ever.

If Bettman manages to keep the Coyotes in PHX I think a good (and right) thing to do would be to award Balsillie an expansion team for 2010-11. That would pretty much end franchise poaching. In this a economy who other than Balsillie could afford to go through the process it takes to buy a team and move it. A few years after that they could give AEG an expansion team for Kansas City to get up to the &quot;holy grail&quot; of 32 teams.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry buddy but the Panthers aren&#8217;t going anywhere so you might want to redraw your map. They are getting sold for a profit and have a pretty unbreakable lease anyways. It would a take situation like the Coyotes are in now to even make it remotely possible and that&#8217;s just not going to happen. You guys up north always like to lump the Panthers in as a team ready to move but unfairly so. Yes, the Panthers struggle on the ice and in attendance but control of the Panthers means control of the other events and advertising revenue in the Panthers rink the bank Atlantic Center. Know what that means? A lot of money. The Panthers are only one piece in a larger puzzle that is ultimately a money maker.</p>
<p>I really do hope you guys get another team up there (Canada deserves at least one more) but it&#8217;s hard for me to see it happening anywhere other than Hamilton (that mainly due to Balsillie&#8217;s $$$). Winnipeg has no one with the bucks to own a team that I know of and a rink built for a minor league team. Quebec City has an old rink and would have that same old problem of attracting free agents with the heavy French environment there. Despite living in Miami I started off as a WHA fan (B&#8217;ham Bulls adopted the Oilers after the Bulls folded) and miss the Jets and Nordiques but I just don&#8217;t see the NHL returning to those cities anytime soon if ever.</p>
<p>If Bettman manages to keep the Coyotes in PHX I think a good (and right) thing to do would be to award Balsillie an expansion team for 2010-11. That would pretty much end franchise poaching. In this a economy who other than Balsillie could afford to go through the process it takes to buy a team and move it. A few years after that they could give AEG an expansion team for Kansas City to get up to the &#8220;holy grail&#8221; of 32 teams.</p>
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		<title>By: modsuperstar</title>
		<link>http://www.modsuperstar.ca/archive/2009/05/22/logistics_of_moving_the_coyotes_to_hamilton/comment-page-1/#comment-2540</link>
		<dc:creator>modsuperstar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 May 2009 18:33:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.modsuperstar.ca/?p=1349#comment-2540</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the feedback Sean.  I had thought of the possibility of fundamentally changing the divisional lineup as well.  Either way it just points to how many waves are being created by this whole process that such changes would even need to occur.  The NHL is obviously pissed they would have to go to such measures to accommodate Balsillie.  Plus your plan would create more travel for every team in the league, which in the short term in a bad economy screws with travel costs, which would in turn cause the salary cap to go down and there is a possibly it could put a few teams who are close to the cusp of financial trouble into it.  I think no matter how you look at it the NHL doesn&#039;t want this to happen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the feedback Sean.  I had thought of the possibility of fundamentally changing the divisional lineup as well.  Either way it just points to how many waves are being created by this whole process that such changes would even need to occur.  The NHL is obviously pissed they would have to go to such measures to accommodate Balsillie.  Plus your plan would create more travel for every team in the league, which in the short term in a bad economy screws with travel costs, which would in turn cause the salary cap to go down and there is a possibly it could put a few teams who are close to the cusp of financial trouble into it.  I think no matter how you look at it the NHL doesn&#8217;t want this to happen.</p>
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